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2000 Archives: CyberThoughts about Betsy and the Flag

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I looked up this site because my husband's family is planning a huge Millennium Family Reunion for this year. His mother asked him and me to dress up as George Washington and Betsy Ross, respectively. We decided to do a bit of libing history, a bit like they do in Williamsburg. I find it interesting that many of those in the older generation have an extreme veneration for the flag as well as this country. They respect it, support it, and appriciate it. It seems to me that those people from my generation and the next don't hold the same views. That is a shame. I often wonder how many of you kids out there realize the privilage that you were given for just being born in the wonderful country. Many people I have known over the years came from other countries and have expressed their amazement at the freedom we have here. The freedom to choose what we do for a living, where we live, who we marry. So many countries and cultures don't give their citizens any choice. I have a new respect for the flag and what it represents--the freedom of choice, I hope some of you do too.
Heidi M., 27, pa [06-30-2000]

The American Flag symbolizes an idea unique to this nation at the time of its conception. Freedom, equality and the empowerment of the people to shape the powers that govern were unknown before the creation of the United States. I see the flag and understand and appreciate the sacrifices that men and women in our history had to make in order to ensure that the principles which define our nation remained true. Each time the nation has been threatened, from within or without, these unsung heros stepped forward and did what was required of them. They came from all sectors of our society, rich and poor, and everyone in between. They served in government, business, the military and every conceiveable endeavor. They strove for the betterment of mankind. They did what was required because the spark, the heart of what it means to be an American lives within them. We live in a nation that is not perfect, there are those that would destroy the efforts of so many, but there remain in every corner of the nation, those who will ensure the survival of the nation and its ideals and principles. The flag is them, it is us, it is me.
Fernando, 55, San Antonio, TX [06-30-2000]

for twenty years i watched the flag fly with dignity and honor. the american flag is a symbol of freedom and every time i see it flown with dignity i still get goose bumps. it symbolizes the wars fought to keep this country free so that we can protest against this country and burn the flag in protest without the fear of being prosecuted for it. i do not understand how any one in this country can stand up and disrespect the flag as i have seen them do since i have retired from the air force. i am a proud american and i still believe in my country. i understandably believe that everyone has the right to their beliefs even if they or unpatriotic like our boy jason. as for vincent you don't have to pledge alligence to your country and i hope someday you have the opportunity to see what it would be like not to have that freedom. vincent read your history books and understand what freedom is all about. learn to appreciate the fact that men and women have fought for this country so the flag can fly free and for you to have the freedom to voice your displeasure about having to "pledge your alligence" to this country. in other countries who do not have the freedom you do could be shot for some of the remarks i have read today. thank god almighty that most americans do not think the same way as jason and vincent. i am proud to have served my country and i would not change a thing. every one in america has the right to voice their opinions. the american flag flys in glory so that we still have the freedom to express these opinions. just like every one who has expressed themselves in this web site. i only ask one thing for all americans to do. stand up and be proud to be an american. as jason suggests i am brainwashed. i am brainwashed that this is the best country in the world. i have freedom to express these beliefs. in a country like cuba i would be told what to express. god bless america and the patrotic people who stand up for her.
DONALD REAVES, age:53; retired msgt usaf; louisville, ky [06-27-2000]

class of '65 abuse case, where the flag is concerned... through a norman rockwell childhood that included study and love and respect for the flag, I took damage in the sociological rape of the late sixties/seventies.....we grew up a lot in our understanding, but it was painful.... as far as the flag goes, I was jubilant when my part of things was teaching cub scouts how to fold it....a lot more positive experience. Packaged in my reception area are two coffin flags...symbol of the vet status of my late husband and my father. Senior relatives on several sides of the family raise the flag daily at family homesteads. There is one at my front door for the patriotic holidays... I served ARCODS and am patriotic.....the sight of our flag has a heartening is not perfect...nor people....nor countries, but the flag is still there, and that makes it better. e.
elle fagan, ct,artist/craftsperson [06-27-2000]

I very much enjoyed this website. I felt like I did not know enough about our U.S. Flag history, and this site changed that. I found a tremendous amount of information. I have always loved seeing our flag fly. I get very sentimental when I hear the song "God Bless the U.S.A." because I know it's true. So many Americans and others have given their lives for our freedom, our rights and our persuit of happiness.... God Bless them, and all people who raise their heads high with pride in America and display the Flag of the United States of America! P.S. "If you can't say something nice, don't say anything at all" you know who said that don't you!
Sharon Perry Schmidt, 46, Woodburn, Oregon [06-25-2000]

Among the items I collect, the most special are historic US flags.Nothing gives me pleasure than to display some of these at special functions, memorials and watch the look on the faces of the people viewing them. Some of the comments I received gave me more satisfaction and good feeling than most anything I can think of. Over the years, I have met many interested people, some Admirals and Generals. some of them felt these flags belong in a museum and to some extent, I agreed. I have also known many special items to lie on their shelves in the basement. I did try once but my offer was refused so now I show them to anyone wishing to see them and enjoy doing it. My strongest wish is for more people to fly their flag, at least on special holidays. There is no greater compliment to an American home than to see our flag waving out in front telling folks where your heart is. M. Sivilli, Tucson, AZ.
Mario T. Sivilli, Age 77, pacific war vet. [06-23-2000]

My flag symolizes all the freedoms and great things we have in this great country. It also reminds me of all the brave men throuhgout the country 's history that gave their lives so that today we live as we do. it wells up pride in me when ever i see it flying or when I sing the national anthem. I will be fovever proud to be an American!
Frank, Long Island, New York [06-16-2000]

I don,t think it matters who or when the flag was created. What does mater is that many lives were sacrificed in defence and honor of that flag. Not so much as a piece of cloth but the ideals that it represents. It is a very visual acknowledgement of my Country. It is intresting to reflect on the many lives that were lost in the desire to protect that Flag and this Country, who also made it possible for the diverse views printed here W S Heimberger
W.S.Heimberger, 65 years old, SanFrancisco [06-16-2000]

Well, well, well. So In Jason we have a prophet who can lead us from the wilderness of our ignorance. Actually, the rantings and ravings of such people do not warrant the anger he refers to. Such carrying-on as he engages in is itself overwhelming evidence of both ignorance and anger. Willful ignorance, at that. But beyond acknowledging this, his kind of comments hardly merits much serious reflection or debate. It is just a bit tiresome that some individuals consider themselves to be among the few who "see the truth"--while the great unwashed continue to be duped by brainwashers. As to the question of whether historians and others just can't tolerate recognition of an important role by women in the Revolutionary War, I doubt that this has much of a bearing on why they raise doubts about the Betsy Ross story. In the same fashion that some criticize (rightly) the wholesale, unquestioning, acceptance of myths passed down from generation to generation, others feel that the myths that serve their purpose are sacred cows that should not be challenged. It is the job of historians to always be skeptical of that which has become almost universally accepted as truth, without, one hopes, becoming the kind of purveyors of political correctness and revisionism that the likes of Jason subscribe to without question. Archaeology, a branch of history, is a case in point. New discoveries, refinement of scientific methods for dating, etc., constantly challenge what once was presumed as "truth." For instance, when I was a kid, we were always taught about the first people crossing into the Americas via the Bering Strait 10,000 years ago. Now we have solid evidence that the first human contact with the Americas occurred thousands of years before that, probably by Asian peoples perhaps arriving by boat (I refer you to Monte Verde, a site in Chile dated at about 13,000 years ago). What is most distressing is that so many people have a political agenda that they want archaeology (or any other branch of history) to support, that they refuse to look at evidence that may not meet their needs. This is intellectual dishonesty. Jason, grow up and stop being so self-indulgent. You could contribute much to the process of challenging historical "myths," but only if you cease to engage in such pathetic, hystrionic, mental masturbation.
Steve Courter, Tucson, AZ 42yrs. [06-16-2000]

I read the recent postings and found humor in one from a young boy, still in school, Vincent Castillenti. He is upset and having to "Pledge Alligence", something he probably doesn't even know the meaning of, and yet his language is quite offensive. My husband has served faithfully in the military for 10 years. We should be proud of our freedom, those who are OF AGE VINCENT!!! We do have freedom, read the constitution. Another person wrote we should read "Lies My Teacher Told Me" then we would have a different view. Well, Michael from GA, were you there when Washington became the first President? How do you know that happened? Were you there when Licoln was shot? How do you know that happened? You are taking the past for granted in that case. Vietnam War wasn't a war yet it's called one. Stand up American be proud of what your ancestors did-who they hoped we'd all become, they died for our freedom, our rights, Betsy Ross was just as much a part of that. The flag stands for freedom. Our government doesn't tell us when to shop, what to buy, when to leave our homes. All the UNpatriotic people, if you don't like what this country was founded on or believe in it-WHY ARE YOU HERE-GET OUT GO FIND A COUNTRY THAT SUITS YOUR SELF CENTERED NEEDS.
Robyn, Proud to be an American [06-11-2000]

Note: No relation to "Boy Jason" Do you know what's so wonderful about this country we live in? It's the right to express our opinion. What's not wonderful is reading bull crap like "Boy Jason" and realizing we share this country with him, and why? He doesn't appreciate the fact that men and women have fought for this country for his freedom. The same freedom he uses to throw his tantrums. Perhaps we should take away all your rights hmm.. yeah let's deport your infantile arse to an uncaring country then you'll be remembering the good US of A when you're running to the U.S. Embassy because noone cares to hear about your sour attitude on their country. Let me tell you "Boy Jason" I am hispanic am proud of my ethnicity but I also am very proud I am an American and might I add I am very patriotic. Occassionaly I run into prejudice remarks but guess what who doesn't? Face up to it and approach it in an educated manner. Grow up, be a man, c'mon you can do it! afterall this is the USA
Tina Mendez-Stanfield [06-09-2000]

I do not believe the fable of Betsy Ross desgining/sewing the flag. How can we trust her relatives stories? The same relatives who then started a tourist attraction at her old home to generate themselves money? Where do we hear of the politicians of the day vouching for her? It's too suspicious that only her relatives told this tale. It seems that the American public in their desire to create hero out of a woman completely took the story by the saddle and rode off with it. I suggest everyone (especially all students) read some of the great "new" history books out there that address the American history textbooks and their continued retelling of fables and farces in their efforts for keeping a proper "christian" education in place in our schools. Try reading "Lies My Teacher Told Me" and see if you can keep the same line of thinking you grew up with intact. I am very proud of my US flag. I proudly served 8 years in the USMC and wouldn't change a thing. Unfortunately, now I see the truth behind what I was "defending".
Michael, 30, Atlanta GA [05-27-2000]

As a young boy I remember parades on Memorial Day & the WWI Veterans & other Veterans & how my teachers taught us about the flag;later as I grew there came WWII and as it progressed and as I grew into Boy Scouts little did I know that someday I too would partake in the Korean War,and would get to have a better feeling of love of Old Glory and later when I visited England & Europe in 1967 there came times that when the flag of our country was shown-I really felt proud and a tingling went up my spine.As one gets older and follows ancestry it makes your futher pride to know they fought in all wars since the Revolutitionary War for the freedom we experience,it sure makes one feel pride in our United States of American. To find out that Betsy Ross was married to my 8th Great grandfather John Claypool really topps it off.We do have the best country in the whole world,its too bad some people don't realize it. I hope that we can again obtain the pride in our country that use to be there. GOD BLESS THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA.
Dean WREN, 68,Kansas City,MO.,Korean War Veteran [05-27-2000]

I have to go to school every day and pledge my allegiance to that god damn flag, so i sat down and didn't do crap. America is corrupt and is full of idiots, so why should I honor it? Now, if I sit for the pledge one more time I will get suspended (ooohh, look at my freedom of choice now!) I don't care if others do, but it's wrong to start kids out, unknowingly pledging their life to the fascist American government. They're brainwashing all of us! I was daydreaming the other day with the intention of sitting down, but I wasn't paying attention. As soon as I heard it, i automatically, without any thought at all, stood up and put my hand on my heart... mind control.
vincent castillenti [05-27-2000]

I was reading in the encyclopedia and it said they weren't sure if Betsy Ross did make the flag. But, I think she did the flag is a great thing it shows everything we stand for we should treat it with respect.
Karisa~, 11 Beaver Utah [05-16-2000]

well i thought i would tell you why i had to do something on betsy ross. well let me think........... i have to dress up like her and build a home like hers and do things like she would. and in some point in that time i have to stich my own flag that i have to think of off the top of my head. and belive me it is really hard to do i would like to see you guys and gals to do the things i have to do.
ashley kriegel, 18 [05-16-2000]

"Boy Jason", with your own past words and text in this forum. You and your stated "communist and anarchist" views are the very last person who should suggest "civic" fundamentals to anyone. Understandably, it is these fundamentals that gives you the right to spew your "BS"; ergo, your misuse of them. Perhaps my last note's most important point was clouded in my criticism of you, let me clarify; "you should leave this forum, for a more appropriate one, which debates the positive attributes of anarchy". Am I suggesting stifling "free speech", NO. Am I suggesting you don't have a right to think/express different views, NO. I am suggesting, "take your "BS" to a political debate site." I, having enjoyed your far reaching efforts to incite or reach as many aspects of reader's buttons, now appreciate your including "God" on your side. On the constructive and even more outgoing perspective, I invite you to "Sturgis" this summer. We have a marvelous "U.S. Flag 101" course. The course's first three minutes on "Flag Burning" are a bit intense, but once past that, you'll have a positive perspective on use of "civic" values. It has been said by some, that this course is even better at teaching "Flag Etiquette" than the Supreme Court. Now "Boy Jason", not like you (you "misspoke" - RE: your 10/11/99 entry), I leave this forum for real. I have been guilty of using it to personally confront "your rhetoric". God Bless America.......
John Pearson, Vietnam Veteran [05-16-2000]

Hi! i am 11 years old and i have something to say.I feel sorry for betsy that her husband,john died in the war and she tried to help him.Then her other husband died too. I know a lot about betsy. She was a good person! She was the 8th out of 17 children!!
anonymous [05-02-2000]

The FLAG stands for all the things on this page. Behind this flag is a set of ideals wich are stated by a number of official papers (like the constitution). Within them they "say" were this flag stands our rules apply now! Our rules aren't perfect, but we all have the opportunity to change them. Some times SOME of us just want to complain by doing the easy things like burning the thing which stands for our rules, instead of doing the hard thing, Calling or writing to their reprrsentatives and talking to others and deciding how or if the rules should be changed. If you don't think I speak the truth, just do the math. Divide how many people vote each year by how many people reside in this GREAT country. I belive that people in this country have the GOD given freedom to burn the flag if they choose. I believe that people have the GOD given choice to object to that burning HOWEVER they see fit. If you protest by mindless lazy violence , don't be suprised if people act violent toward you. I personaly believe both are wrong....I would not do either one of those acts, But... I wounder how many of those people who burn flags have the phone number of the local ward representatives, not to mention their sen. govnr. or anyone else who is in charge of changing these "BAD" rules. I love the FLAG of these united states I respect it & I would die for what it stands for whether you know the history of the flag or not, whether or not you know that we have another flag that is almost never mentioned, or whether you care or not really doesn't matter If YOU would just stop for A MOMENT and think about the meaning of this flag I believe YOU would see that burning just makes YOU look foolish & full rage not someone looking for change. ONLY where this flag flies do YOU have the FREEDOM to do what you choose to do with yourself SO LONG AS IT DOESNT HURT OTHERS!
Brian K Osborne, 30somethin KansasCity MO [05-02-2000]

I want to thank Elizabeth (Betsy) Griscom for creating this flag, symbol of our freedom from the British rule.
Constance, age 11 [05-02-2000]

i the flag is grate it shows we are a county (back then)
Katherine, 15 [05-02-2000]

I have read all the peoples thoughts on this page and I am very disappointed at the way some people feel about the flag,our flag. It represents everything that this country stands for. When you see the flag of even if it just passes by you, you should get goose pumps and feel a very strong sense of pride and satisfaction that you live in this great country of ours. A lot of people have given their all for this country and it is a shame that some people treat the flag the way it is treated. Our children need to learn all they can about our flag and this great country we live in. Our children cannot pray in schools any more, so maybe they cannot say the pledge to our flag either. This is our country and our flag so please love and respect them both. A lot of good people made our freedoms possible, men like my father, Pfc Charlie Key and my husband Sgt. Walt Winitsky. Please love our country and our flag.
Jo Ruth Winitsky, Athens, Tenn. 47 years old [05-02-2000]

civil war. the north invaded the south.i respect the confederate flags much more than the u s flag
Larry [05-02-2000]

I served under our Nation's Colors for 24 years, including three voluntary combat tours. I fly them and the Corps' standard on twin poles in front of our farmhouse where I take enormous pleasure in being able to salute them, in freedom, as a daily ritual. Yet the thought of tampering with our Constitution to supposedly protect it is bothersome. Desecration of the National Flag is a provoking act which, like "FIRE!" in a crowded theater is not protected. It is punishable under disturbance of the peace or inciting to riot. That's enough. H. L. "Rich" Richey LtCol, USMC (Ret)
Rich Richey, 62, Jemison, AL [05-02-2000]

I would like to know what people think about the many flags that are flown at car dealerships. I don't think that our flag should be used as an advertisement. Any comments?
Heather [05-02-2000]

Shows how much you know about what the flag supposedly stands for, and how much you believe in this country. Rights are never earned, nor do they (or should they) need to be. Rights are only earned in fascist states. In America, we're supposed to be recognizing them as God given and for everyone, regardless of their political beliefs of backgrounds. But I guess you missed that part of Civics eh?
Jason Mendez [05-02-2000]

"The Stars & Stripes", "Old Glory", These names mean so much and yet so little. So much because they are the names of a flag that has endured nearly 224 years of wars, conflicts, depressions, good presidents, lousy presidents, and all kinds of strife and struggles within our government and still waves proudly. It means so little to so many people that seemingly nobody respects it any more. I was at a Veteran's Day parade in my hometown last November and noticed that I was the only one I could see who was saluting the flag as it passed. As a Vietnam Veteran that is a disgrace! There is so much complaining about the abuse of the American Flag (and rightly so) and yet no one cares enough to render proper respect during a parade. The Flag is displayed in all sorts of unheard of ways today. The only place where I still see the Flag getting proper respect is on military bases and even there it is not like it used to be. Study the Flag ettiquete and laws on this page, folks, and render due respect to our national symbol. Thank You
Bill Farris, Wahiawa, Hawaii [05-02-2000]

Oh no, not the "Boy Jason" again! Inspite of your grandiose 10/11/99 farewell speech, your back? Still no note from your Mom and your spewing more rhetoric. I like the injected "got me to thinking" in your 4/9/00 entry (I also like your inferred, still speaking for the masses - Indians/Blacks). We've concluded (includes your own admission - "rhetoric from communists or anarcists" RE: your 10/11/99 note) that you have no original thoughts. Please note since your promised departure, that the forum has had many entries, both pro and con on the flag. These entries are expressed primarily from first person perspectives (not your old tired, malcontent and never-do-well resources). What happened to your looking for new pages to alienate; let me guess, they ran your BS off also. For all the faults that can be attached to the FLAG as a symbol, it's still good enough to reflect a government that grants you, your un-earned rights. Freedom was never free.........
John Pearson, Vietnam Veteran [04-16-2000]

Seeing the uproar over the Confederate Battle flag being flown throughout the south got me thinking...thinking about how our flag could not possibly repulse indians (the few who are left) and blacks. And then I realized that for many it does. But you never see that with the oh-so balanced reporting of our corporate news media (more interested in getting a profit than broadcasting the news). The Stars and Stripes that so many of you think means so much actually flew over slavery for almost 100 years before the Civil War (which was not fought to end slavery) ended. And it was the flag carried into battle against the women and children at Wounded Knee. Just food for thought.
Jason Mendez [04-09-2000]

Lots of folks equate flags to nationalism. That's unfortunate because the US flag goes far beyond that. It is a symbol of not only our country, but of a set ideals that have taken on a life of their own. The entire planet is slowly coming around to seeing that many of our founding principles make sense for all people on Earth. For instance: liberty, justice, community, and responsibility. As more people around the world become aware of what they can become, their expectations enable them, and everyone around them, to lift themselves up to a better life. The US just happened to hit upon the right combination of ideas to allow more individuals to prosper than ever before. This knowledge is spreading across the planet like wildfire. It's changing everything. That's what the flag really symbolizes.
BillG [04-01-2000]

Obviously those that don't know the true origin, it's history, would not believe what it represents is significant. The flag is more than a symbol. The youth of our nation do not understand, for all they do is to imitate the beliefs of parents or other adults when it comes to being critical regarding flag protection acts. We have come to re-define our 1st amendment rights, and now buring is a form of free speech. Grow up america.
Pete Fabiani, Sheridan, Wyoming [04-01-2000]

Although some may think that the American flag means nothing, it truely does, probably more so to those who have really contributed into making our nation a free one. The flag is more than a symbol; it is a memory. Many people keep odds and ends to remember a specific event, and i believe that the American Flag is like a memorial of our history. It was said during the Revolutionary War, "We are fightin so that a man can stand up. Anything less is not worth it." Even though some things become corrupt in our nation, (And the amount of corruption is a matter of opinion), we must always remember what we have fought for, and what EVERYONE has gained. Here, now, it is not only so that a man can stand up, but so that a woman can stand up, and a child can stand up. Things are not perfect, and never will be. But we have come pretty far. To me, looking at the flag is like looking at the lessons we have learned. If there was no flag, would we be the nation-wide symbol that bonds up, something that we all can see, not just the liberty bell only in Philadelphia. It means something differnet if you have truely fought for it, the flag does, and so perhaps the only time that we can truely all "get it" is when we all fight together for a common cause. P.S.: Speaking of common causes, shouldn't there be a flag representing the whole world, every country?
Christy [03-23-2000]

The Flag really doesn't mean anything to me. Although people say that there are people who have died for it, it still doesn't mean anything. I really think that those people died for there families and theirself. I really don't know who Betsy Ross is so I have nothing to say about her. The flag to me is no more than cloth. I feel that if someone wants to burn the flag then they should have the freedom to. It is just wasting their money.
Dan Riley, Arlington High School St. Paul [03-15-2000]

What I think what the flag means to me is... I think it mean to me is when someone dose not respecked our State. I think that someone made the flag, fought for the flag and the State, and other things that people did for our flag and State. That we should respecked that and not fight of little thing that mack a big deal to the world. The world is for evereone not one person. And when one preson macks a differnet to the childern, teenagers, and of corse Adults. Alsults needs to lesson to everone not 4 people. So now that 1, 2, 3 or 5 million people can mack a differet. also lesson to the childern and teenagers we have a lot to say and no one lessons to us.
Jesica [03-15-2000]

The american flag actually dosen't mean a lot to me as a whole it just seems like a symbol of america and all of the things that make america.
Coriandre Mooree [03-15-2000]

i heard about Betst Ross just awihle ago. at first i thought that she was a president's wife or something. now i know that she was a lady who designed the american flag. that is really cool. tome the american flag represents the freedom and indepence that people have in this country. but i also think of all the false hopes that people had when they first came to the u.s. they thought that they would have more freedom aand other stuff when they reached america, "the land of opportunity". so many dreams were in a way shattered when they realized that america isn't so great after all.
Tanya, 15 st paul mn arlington high school [03-15-2000]

The American flag means a lot to me. One main thing it means to me is our freedom. It symbolizes all the turmoil we have been through to achieve it too. Sometimes when I look at the flag, each different color means something and each different part means something too. To me the stars on the blue shows that were all equal because we all look under the same sky at night. The red shows how much we went through to get our independence, it represents all the blood that was shed when we put up a fight. When I see our flag I see our whole country as one. I really don't know that much about Betsy Ross. When I think of her I think of the lady who came up with the first flag. Until now I have always belived that but just recently I have learned that she may have not actually made the first flag. What Betsy Ross means to me is someone who saw what our country really was and wanted to show it with a simple design. She saw our country as one nation, not just a bunch of nations made to share the same big hunk of land. Betsy Ross to me is just another person in history who took one step farther for the country. I think others probably said it better than I could, but I never learned much about her. I just always pictured her as someone who had a lot of spare time and was just doing old George a favor. Well that is what we are known for here I think!? I mean we help others in war we provide relief, Betsy Ross to me symbolizes the country, because we are always asked for favors.
Allison [03-14-2000]

The flag doesn't have any meaning because sometimes it brings the USA shame. I don't really think of anything about the flag because it just represents the United States and our reactions and comments to other countries. Also, if I was another country going to war, I would say "Butt out United States!!!" Because it's not our business. That's probabl why many countries burn our falg. They obviously hate us. Betsy Ross is a very intelligent person for coming up with the American flag and making it represent our freedom for the battles in the thirteen colonies. But when American Indians look into our flag, they think that it's nothing. The Englishmen came and took our land and freedom. Why should we respect the flag? They should because now it is a part of their land and they can't do anything to it.
Mai Vue, 15, St. Paul, Arlington High School, Mr. Hill [03-14-2000]

I am very much a patriot of the U.S. of A. This flag represents to me a freedom only America could ever represent Sometimes this freedom is absolurely wonderful and appreciated, but just as well, it can be taken advantage of in numerous unrespectful ways. To my parents, the American flag means so much more. They are Hmong and I'm pretty sure they have two opinions of this flag. One, burn it...who wants a flag that symbolizes the treachery and despair the CIA persuaded the Hmong into? America is too sinful, selfish, and money- grubbing-who needs a symbolic flag for this possessive country? Or two( the good view ), this flag symbolizes the second chance at life that America has given to the Hmong. All through our history, we have been continually persecuted upon and truthfully, America has been the first to willingly accept our becoming residents of it. America has been generous to us and we are grateful for it. This is what the American flag means to me.
Ma Lee Vang, age 15 from St. Paul,MN [03-14-2000]

I can't believe the different views I found at this site. Most of you are patriots and get offended when anyone says anything "offensive" about the flag. I too am a patriot, but am taking a class titled vexillology and nationalism. Vexillology is the study of flags. It is amazing to see the other side of things. I still believe everyone should appreciate where they live. We should think of freedom as a priveledge not a right. Anyway the flag is a flag and it means different things to different people. Many have been raised according to America's civil religion and that is where the whole 'patriotism' thing comes from. However, we are not the only people on Earth who think that we are the chosen people and that our land is the "promised land." Lets not hate each other over disagreements like this. We are all people, and most who are reading this are probably all Americans. Be proud not hatefull.
Tonya, Undergraduate Student, San Jose State Univ [03-07-2000]

Betsy Ross does not mean anything to me because I didn't know who made the flag until now. Other than that she must have had a lot of spare time to make the flag. The flag to me means something big because it symbolizes all the states. When i see the flag it kinda reminds me of the soldiers in the war and also all the Presidents and states. The importance of the flag to the country is that actually i have no clue what the importance is but i do know it is important because everyone always just about before anything we always say the "pledge of allegance."
brandy dennis, 13, sand springs [03-07-2000]

I think that the house is huge. It is compared to mine. I think it is cool how our united states flag got started!! The house that it was created in was amazing. I was always wondering who came up with the idea to make the united States flag. I love to learn about history. But I think that if schools could find a way to make the subject more fun, the more the kids will like to learn about these things. But a lot of grownups like things long and boring. They don't know that it takes a lot for some kids to get into things. Something I love to learn in school (which is about every subject) and other things are not that interesting. But I have to learn that most of this things I learn in school I will need when I grow up!
Jaclyn, 13 years old [03-06-2000]

When I first learned of Betsy Ross I was in grade school and loved the idea she made The Flag. I wanted to know more and the teacher moved on with the lesson, which didn't include anything more about B.R. I have always been interested in sewing, many years later I quilted a flag for my sister and brother. When I think of "our flag" I think of our history; religion,wars,freedom,love,and respect for all. So many times when I would think of a name to represent my business, it just never said an "image" it needed to be love and choices I get to make each day and came up with American Praire Quilts. Red, White and Blue it can and will continue to mean lots of different things to all the different people who live here. The first thing I think of is freedom,(Red)love,(White),faith(Blue). I think maybe Besty should have made it HEART-SHAPED, perhaps that would remind us all that; we should keep love in our hearts for all to where here "first", those who came to "settle",for those that came for what ever reason and those that continue to think this is a GREAT place to be. When we work together learn from the past and grow for the future of the country. When you see the flag it means give EVERYONE a choice and chance to be the BEST they can BE....brotherly love past it on!!!! I wish the best for each and everyone of our citizens, Happy 4th of July. :)
Rita G., Waterloo, Iowa [03-03-2000]

About the colors of the flag of the United States of America. Because our country was founded on Godly principles, our flag was created as a representation of the colors associated with Salvation in Jesus Christ. The red represents the Blood of Jesus which washes away all sin. The White represents the purity of a soul after you have recieved Christ as your personal savior. (The blood washes away our all sin and makes us white as snow!) The blue represents the heavens where Believers in Jesus Christ will spend eternity.
Debbie McFarland [02-18-2000]

Nah, that Indian guy wasn't me. Just another educated individual. You figured it was me because sensible comments and an open mind to something other than fascist compulsory patriotism are hard things to find on this web site. It still amazes me how angry patriots get. Their belief that the only people who should live here are patriots will never cease to amaze me. Sorta reminds me of Nazi and Soviet propaganda films of decades past. Anyone who isn't a patriot is a "counter-revolutionary". Funny how when official opinion condemns dissidents in Cuba, we call it oppression. But when the same thing happens in the United States, we call it patriotism. But who accused the United States of having the most educated population anyway?
Jason Mendez [02-18-2000]

C.N.Red, C.N.Red, C.N.Red,,,,,come on, you don't only agree with Jason Mendez (a self declared agitator), you mimic him. Your physical existence indicates that "your" ancestors weren't the ones murdered. A Grad History student that chooses "love it or leave it" over "the only good Indian is a........"; strange an Indian critic who wouldn't prefer ridiculing the latter. By the way, I have two good friends who have Indian ancestory, Cherokee and Blackfoot. They are proud of their heritage and aware of wrong doings in their history, but they don't have your attitude. Hang the flag anyway you want to, as an expression, that's the "AMERICAN" way! Personally, I think we have Jason Mendez or his blood brother under a new "pen name".
I.M. Redwhiten'blue, American [02-16-2000]

The thoughts expressed on this page run to both extremes,those of the young or foolish, who do not yet understand the benefits of citizenship in this great country, who have not contributed in any way to the establishment or maintenance of freedom and the other group who have seen or been a part of the great sacrifices made by those who cherish and respect their freedoms. I wonder why some of those public figures most visable such as the millionaire atheletes are among the most disrespectful.
Evan Howell [02-16-2000]

I agree with Jason Mendez. He seems to be the only educated person involved in this utterly pointless flag discussion. I am also educated. I have been educated at one of your finest universities. I say "your" because I am an Indian, not an Indian from the East but an Indian from right here in the U.S.A.. Obviously the so called freedom that most of you patriots speak of never included my people. I happen to be a grad student studying history, so I know a thing or two. The intervention of which Jason speaks is true. The U.S. government was and is involed in a lot of nasty things. Read the book "Inevitable Revolutions" by Walter LaFeber, you patriots might find it interesting, or read the book "Killing Hope" by William Blum. The other thing you can do is look for an Indian to talk to. It might be somewhat difficult to find one because most of us were already murdered. The flag to me is a symbol of the death of my people and that is why I will always hang it upside down. I love when patriots say, "love it or leave it", that's a strange thing to say to an Indian, isn't it?
C. N. Red [02-14-2000]

i am going to miss betsy ross she made first flag of the united states
joel sowder, 21 winfield i love flags [02-11-2000]

I for one think that the flag is a symbol of American history. It brings a lot in everyone. It shows that we can beat em' only if we try as hard as we need to no matter what they say. They couldn't win then and they can't win now. The government is stronger than ever. The flag is an American tradition for everyone, and that's why it was made. To honor and respect the America Nation as we know it.
Anthonyj. [02-11-2000]

Since everybody is telling why they came on this sight, I thought that I would tell my reason. I have a history final, and I have to dress up like Betsy Ross, so I came on this sight wanting to know what kind of clothes that she wears. I liked the reason from the guy searching for wallpaper. That was funny. I just want to remind everyone that we are supposed to be telling our opinions on the flag and Betsy Ross, as opposed to the quarling that I am experiencing here. Well my opinion is that we are truly blessed to have a country that has religious freedom.(I'm a Christian) There are many countries that don't even have the choice to hear about God and such. Our country was founded on the Word of God and it's sad to see how it has wandered for from that. Yet, we are still free to worship and to go to church and that is a HUGE blessing. I Thank the Lord for my place in this world and country. God Bless!!!
Heather, 16 [01-10-2000]

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